Rebel Health Tribe Spotlight – Episode 14: Nisarga Eryk Dobosz

Michael Roesselin:

And we’re live with another episode of the Rebel Health Spotlight. I’m your host, Michael. I have a special guest for you today. I’m excited in this series to be able to bring on a few of my own teachers that I’ve learned from over the last several years. And today we’re joined by Nisarga Dobosz.

Nisarga, thank you for being here.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Thank you, Michael for inviting me to the podcast. I’m very honored and grateful.

Michael Roesselin:

Thank you. Yeah, it’ll be a fun conversation. I think we might introduce this audience to some new things. They know that I’ve kind of been off learning some new things the last few years that are a little bit different than what I’d been doing previously, but they may not know a lot about it.

So first I’d like you to just share a little bit about yourself and just really who you are and what you’re doing professionally. You do such an interesting mix of modalities and practices, so I’d love to hear how you talk about it.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Thank you. Thank you, Michael. My name is Nisarga Eryk Dobosz. I was born in Poland and at the moment I live in Greece, and I started my journey around ’98. There was a journey of bodywork and massage. I was, at the time, working as engineer for international American corporation in UK and I was feeling that something is missing in my life even though my job was very fulfilling in many other aspects, but my soul was missing something out. So I started some inner journey. I met, at the time, a psychotherapist who was also bodyworker and I was receiving a lot of bodywork. My life has changed dramatically. I was feeling a lot of bliss, a lot of different sensations, a lot of emotions at the time, and it really intrigued me how quickly my body started changing. I was very stiff, had a lot of pain. I had episodes of depression at the time, and that approach of body oriented approach with psychotherapy really was mind-blowing.

So I decided to go deeper into it. I decided to study. I decided to learn meditations, yoga and bodywork. It was my entry. And I was, at the time, still one leg in the corporate world and one leg in the spiritual world, and somehow tried to combine those two worlds and it was somehow not easy. And then in 2008, I decided to commit fully to my spiritual path, quit my corporate life and moved to India. And since then, traveled for first 10, 15 years, traveled around Asia, America looking for teachers that I wanted to study, took many courses of different sorts starting from primal Vipassana, tantra, a lot of meditations, studied little bit of Buddhism in Himalayas.

And so it was a healing journey. It was healing journey. I never thought I would become a professional therapist of bodywork or breathwork. And it was a beautiful journey that opened me up and taught me many different approaches to the body oriented modalities, somatic modalities. Later on, I discovered breathwork by dynamic breath work and tremor release that completely shifted again my body and my understanding of trauma, my understanding of emotional fluidity. And I started combining breathwork, bodywork and biodynamic craniosacral, and lately also compassionate inquiry, which is trauma oriented approach.

So yeah, it’s a beautiful mixture, but I think the core of what I’m offering is trusting body wisdom to unfold what needs to be unfold in the space of presence and compassion basically. So this is the core what I’m doing.

Michael Roesselin:

Wow. I didn’t know you used to be an engineer. I think you’re so far down your new path that there’s very little evidence anymore. There’s a lot of engineers… I also am trained in compassionate inquiry and I’ve trained with Nisarga in biodynamic breathwork. That’s where I met him. And in these fields I meet a strange number of ex-engineers and usually they still have some tendencies or some traits of an engineer. I can tell they’re very system oriented or structure oriented or they’re still in the left brain quite a bit, but they’re trying to do right brain things, and I don’t pick any of that up from you. I think the path through the body, instead of going to the psychology first, I think the path through the body maybe softens that a bit more.

So you started mostly with body work and massage. You do teach myofascial energetic release and you teach a form of Hawaiian bodywork, right?

Nisarga Dobosz:

Yes. I teach also Hawaiian bodywork, lomi lomi nui coming from Polynesia and myofascial energetic release, which is deep bodywork, working on fascia and superficial deep fascia, but also include all emotions, movement, breath.

Michael Roesselin:

Okay, that’s next. I’m going to try to come to at least one of those in Poland in 2024.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Please go. Poland or Estonia.

Michael Roesselin:

Or Estonia. I’m curious. I’ve never been to Estonia, so that would be fun.

Nisarga Dobosz:

You will love it. You will love it. Fantastic country.

Michael Roesselin:

Kasha from our group was just there and she said it was beautiful.

I’m curious, you mentioned you had a lot of body pain before you started, when you met the psychotherapist who was using body-based therapy and your pain has resolved quite a bit. What kind of physical conditions or diseases… Because we mentioned trauma, you mentioned compassionate inquiries, a trauma-focused approach, biodynamic breathwork and trauma release is obviously a trauma-focused approach. So obviously these modalities have a mental, emotional, spiritual component to them, but I think a lot of times people don’t realize that that mental, emotional, spiritual is not separate from the physical and physical pain or physical disease or physical challenges.

So I’m curious, in the last… No, I had to look at the year, I always forget, but when you said ’98, it’s been 25 years and which is crazy. When people say 10 years ago, I think of 1998, so it’s been 25 years. And I’m curious, in all of your travels and your trainings and the clients you’ve worked with and the students that you’ve taught, what have you seen as far as changes in people’s physical health, physical bodies, like the state of their physical body when it comes to doing this breathwork or trauma focused therapies or body work? People might not realize the shift that can happen in their physical state. So I’m curious what you’ve seen happen.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Our body stores every single experience. Our body stores memories from past experiences. Either it’s developmental trauma, shock trauma or accidents, and it stores in form of fulcrums. And those fulcrums are kind of centers where we store these feelings that we were not able to express back then during the event. And so when we live with those memories of the body, we might discover that certain parts of our body are disconnected, numb, we lose sensations in those parts, and those parts can sometimes store a lot of pain, but because we are disconnected from feeling pain or pleasure in those places, we feel nothing is happening. We feel the stiffness in those parts. We might not even be aware that there are some parts of the body we don’t feel. And for everybody it can be different. For some people it could be area of the throat. They have difficulty to express. There’s a lump in their throat. For somebody else, it can be chest, belly, pelvis, foot, shoulder.

And what I am noticing that very often the cause of this tensions in the body is denied and expressed feelings that’s stored in the body. And since this 25 years, I have noticed many different changes starting from a more kind of visible like frozen shoulder. I had a situation where somebody with a severe pain and frozen shoulder where could not lift her arm more than 90 degrees. During the opening session without even being touched, expressed grief and sadness very deeply for a few minutes, and before even we started, she could raise, completely, her arm upwards. She couldn’t be believe it and I was impressed also. Just by connecting to this grief.

And then people who are working with me over months or years that come for the trainings and for example, their body posture improves dramatically. Let’s say, let’s take into consideration the person who might be collapsed posture, shoulders collapse, head goes forward, there’s a protection around the heart, protection around the shoulders. And over time, this armoring start melting and their posture become more fluid, more flexible. They express their feelings and they become more flexible in their movement. And the movement, not only superficial movement, but also the core around the spine. There’s a lot of different structures that hold the feelings in our core, fear, rage, anger, and all those feelings are trapped and then they cause tension.

I mean so many different ways, I noticed the changes. But also sometimes it’s subtle. It’s the change that can be spiritual change also, like something that somebody is living their life on automatic, reacting to environment. Let’s say, I’m driving and there’s a traffic and I get upset and I start shouting at others and then few minutes later… Or shouting at my closed ones and then few minutes later I’m like, oh, my God. Why did I say that? Why did I explode like that? There was no reason for it.

And then next time driving the same situation and catching themselves. Oh, instead of shouting, let me check where is this rage? Where is it coming from? What is the cause? Because those situations are just showing us something from the past. And it can be huge, like in internal environment, this kind of shift and catching ourself in those moments where we don’t react but we have a moment to, okay, let me take a few deep breath and let me see what I can do with it. And maybe I can see that this person who is blocking me in front of the traffic is there because somebody else is blocking him also. It’s not his fault. So why should I shout at him? Let me just see why this anger is there in the first place. What has happened in the past that my system is firing constantly with certain feelings?

Either it’s fear, anger, rage, because those are rockets, those are feelings of rockets that are protecting our defense mechanism, which is underneath, which could be fear, that could be grief, that could be difficult to feel, but we created this defense mechanism because it was necessary. It was survival mechanism in the past. So it affects people in so many levels. What I see working with people that it’s a beautiful work that starting from subtle changes, spiritual, emotional, and always the physical body is following because if we address the emotions, the physical body changes.

Michael Roesselin:

Yeah, thank you for sharing that.

There was somebody in our group in Poland. This is September 2023. I was in March, I was in Poland at a training with Nisarga and somebody in our group had a, I wouldn’t say as severe of a frozen shoulder as you were describing, but they had a lot of trouble with the shoulder, and by Tuesday, the arm was up in the air. So it was maybe two sessions that they had received and very little body work. It was mostly just breathing and moving. So it doesn’t have to be touch. As you mentioned, there’s other ways to move these things.

And I’m curious… I think I know because this was for me too, you got into this kind of work for yourself. It was so impactful for you that you thought, I need to learn more of this, I need to do more of this. And the same was for me. Five years ago, I was suicidally depressed and I had an experience that shifted this and I thought, wow, I need to keep going. I need to do more of this and I need to learn it and I want to share this and I want to do this. So it sounds like the beginning was similar, but now that you’ve been doing it as a career for a long time, I’m curious, what’s your favorite part about it or why do you do it or why do you love it so much? What do you love about it and teaching too?

Nisarga Dobosz:

Well, what I love about the work is connection, it’s intimacy, is feelings. In the groups that I’m teaching or individual session, there’s always factor of emotions and intimacy and presence. Every single session or group structure that I’m leading, it really somehow brings me back to my center. I have to be very, very present. And being in this environment, being centered, being coming back to my heart in a compassionate presence, being with others, seeing others in their most vulnerable expressions, allowing myself also for most vulnerable expressions, it’s so fulfilling that any other occupation in the world, I wouldn’t change to that because it gives certain fulfillment in my heart, in my body.

And there’s also a factor of changing people’s lives. I believe that if we choose a profession that is directly changing other people lives so dramatically and there’s this sense of fulfillment, we will never treat it as a job. It becomes a passion, it becomes fun, it becomes something that we want to keep doing, keep learning, keep growing because it has impact on others and it brings so much fulfillment. So those are major qualities that I love what I’m doing and I never think of it as a job, as a work. It’s just my passion and there’s no way back. This is something that I would not change for anything.

Michael Roesselin:

There’s no going backwards. I’ve learned that.

Nisarga Dobosz:

[inaudible 00:17:26].

Michael Roesselin:

I’m only about five years into shifting and changing and doing all this new work, and there’s only forward steps. You may pause for a little bit, but there’s no going backwards.

And my experience in Poland, and I’ve been to a couple other retreat style trainings like you’re describing, and the intimacy and the connection and the vulnerability and the aliveness that comes from these experiences. I had the idea in my head when I went to Poland that I wanted to host retreats here in Italy. And after leaving, I immediately started working with someone here to plan them and set them up, and we’re going to be hosting our first retreats in May and June in 2024, because I also want to experience that same and facilitate it, give that gift to people who maybe don’t have it in their everyday life, and what that experience of that circle and that connection and that aliveness can be. So it was really an inspiration to make that start happening.

And so you teach a lot of things. You also work with clients to an extent. Where can people find you? Where are the best places to go for people to find you and your work and your trainings? Which organizations or what website or social media? We’ll share links down below, but where would be the best place for people to go?

Nisarga Dobosz:

Yeah. Before I reply to this. I’m very happy that you are offering the trainings next years. I think you have a great knowledge and understanding and your journey of last five years, what I’ve seen you in the group and it’s beautiful. So I think it’s a beautiful gift you can offer to others.

Michael Roesselin:

Thank you.

Nisarga Dobosz:

So I’m happy you’re stepping up and by teaching, you’re learning so much. So that’s fantastic. You will make a quantum leap. It’s the best way to learn.

Where you can find me? Maybe Facebook and Instagram. Nisarga Eryk Dobosz is my profile. I also have two schools that I founded. One is in Poland called Integral Body Institute is the platform that organized and facilitate different modalities by dynamic breathwork, trauma release, myofascial energetic release, and I also teach in Estonia and Finland and the school for Finland and Estonia is called Body Awareness Institute, also present on Instagram and Facebook.

Michael Roesselin:

Okay, we will have all those links down below. We do have our people in our community in Europe, so it’s easier trip for them to come to some of these places to experience some of these things. You also work virtually. If people contact you, it’s possible to work virtually. I did a wonderful session with Nisarga last week, and for those in the States and in North America, it’s worth the trip over here to experience some of these things. And biodynamic breathwork is also taught in Mexico, Bali, and they recently did a workshop in Canada with different teachers, but same modality.

Nisarga Dobosz:

And Australia. There will be also now we are launching again in Australia. I’ll be teaching in January. It’s on the calendar. So if you go to biodynamicbreath.com, you click on calendar, you will see all locations including Australia. So if you are around that area, then come join me in Australia.

Michael Roesselin:

And he’s a DJ for Ecstatic Dance on the side, which is kind of an inside joke, but he’s going to get me to go to an Ecstatic dance event at some point.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Yeah, I loved it.

Michael Roesselin:

And lastly, I’m curious if you can share something, a practice or two. It can be something really simple that people that are listening to this or watching could try or start to do or implement in their life, either a practice or anything that you want to share that you think could be good for somebody to start or become more mindful of.

Nisarga Dobosz:

I love simplicity. I think simplicity is the key. One of the most simplest practices I do on daily basis is simply Vipassana meditation. So just meditation where you can sit, observe yourself, bring awareness to the felts of the body. So basically it’s quite simple where you can find a quiet place and breathe gently through the nose and observe your breath, in and out, longer breath, in and out. And check in, scan your body and check in what’s present in this moment, emotionally, physically don’t attach to any thoughts. Just let them pass through. Let them pass through. And we get attached to those thoughts, those emotions. Then it becomes sometimes too personal. We get lost in those thoughts. So it’s really helps to clear our mind and be present.

If you want something more vigorous, more something that is releasing something from fascia, I recommend shaking. It’s beautiful way to shake for 10, 15 minutes. You can put some music of your likes. I like shaking with the [inaudible 00:23:13] or something that has a little bit of African drumming. It gives this kind of sense of grounding. And be loose. Be loose, and pay attention to the parts of the body that are stiff and let them go, let them go, let them go and let them go again.

And sometimes we hold tension in the parts that we’re not even aware. Sometimes it’s our face, maybe our eyes, sometimes it’s pelvis or we hold a lot of tension in our belly, in our diaphragm. So just keep scanning, keep shaking and bring liquid in your body. We are 70% of water. This fluid matrix that is connective tissue in our body, this wrapping, fascial wrapping that holds everything together. But important part of this liquid matrix is that is also suspended in our nervous system. So when we gently shake, we also bring our nervous system to parasympathetic state where we can feel more safe, more secure, more at ease instead of relaxation, where we can find that peace in our body. And from that space we can relate in a very mindful and loving way with environment, with our colleagues, friends, family, and it’s very, very beautiful.

So these two practices are quite simple. I like doing ortho myofascial unwinding, but this is more complex. This requires a little bit of more introduction. And for this, I would suggest that you find me and book a session or come to our trainings because you need to practice a few times. It’s a little bit more complex way. But in the essence, in my myofascial unwinding, you find this way of connection in the body and you find this undulating movement of your spine and you trust your body wisdom and you follow the movement. You don’t do the movement, but you follow the movement. The body has its own wisdom. And when you just close your eyes and you allow this movement to come from the core out in a slow way, not mechanical, but in a slow way, there’s something beautiful happening with the body fluidity, with the body connection. And this is something that I really love doing. It just melts all my tension and brings me back to this energetical flow when I feel joy and happiness in my body.

Michael Roesselin:

Perfect. So you have a mindfulness of a ortho Vipassana meditation, scanning the body, being present with what’s there, let the thoughts come. That’s a big misconception with meditation that I held for a long time, was that you’re supposed to shut off your brain and this is impossible. So then you’ll go crazy and you’ll think you’re terrible at meditation, but let the thoughts come, let them go. And just be paying attention to the body and how it feels and your breath. And then you mentioned shaking, and that can be with different types of music. You like drums, anything with a bass to it, a grounding kind of sound.

And then the unwinding movement, which I was very resistant to when I started BBTRS training. I would sit there and I’m like, nothing happens. My body doesn’t do anything. And that lasted until I went to Poland and after a couple sessions in Poland, it would do it for the whole session. And it was making up for lost time I think. But everything moved so much more fluidly, and not only did my body feel more loose and relaxed, but my overall state and way of being followed that, because, as we mentioned earlier, these things are not separate.

And so thank you for those practices and for sharing and for turning your own experience into a passion which you now teach and share with others. I’ve been very grateful to learn at your trainings and look forward to more. And thanks for the time and sharing all this today.

Nisarga Dobosz:

Thank you. Thank you, Michael for inviting me. I really appreciate it. And it was great to talk to you today.